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Going to Stanford... (Read 7804 times)
KTiller
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Freeland, USA, usa, 51, 28, WA, Washington
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Going to Stanford...
Oct 21st, 2007 at 5:57pm
 
I've been reading the messages on this wonderful website for the last several months. Thank you for sharing your wonderfully hopefull and helpful information.  Because of  what I have learned here, I called Dr. Gary Steinberg's office. on a Friday, they received my images on Monday morning, they were reviewed in the weekly conference that evening and I received a call at 6:30PM the same evening from Teresa Bell-Stevens telling me that the diagnosis is Moyamoya, that I need by-pass surgery on both sides and would be receiving a call within the week regarding dates for diagnostic tests and surgeries. Wow - what an amazing response!

I'd experienced tingling and numbness along my left thumb, index finger several times this Spring, but on July 6th my left upper lip was numb for several minutes. I went to the local ER where they did a CAT scan which showed nothing, , then saw my family doctor who ordered an MRI/MRA.  I had the procedure a week or so later and was just turning into the ferry line afterwards (I live on Whidbey Island in Washigton State) when I received an urgent call from my doctor regarding the blocked and narrowed arteries. He scheduled and appointment with a neurologist in Everett. I saw him a week or two later. He was the first to mention the possibility of Moyamoya. He sent me to Harborview Stroke Clinic in Seattle. The Neurologist there ordered non-invasive Doppler studies and dis a physical examination. He then scheduled 4 vessel angiogram for the next week and a follow-up appointment for one MONTH later. The results of diagnostic tests were presented to a stroke conference at Harborview that Friday evening - then my neurologist left the country for two weeks and left me in the dark...

His wonderful assistant finally got an email response from him a week and a half later - He told her I was to continue taking the baby aspirin and platlete thinner and no other treament was recommended at that time. When he returned to the  country, he called me, discussed the angiogram results. He said I had atherosclerosis, and ordered a lumbar puncture and some additional blood tests. We met again a month after my first appointment.

Meanwhile, I found this website and gathered copies of ALL of my edical records and diagnostic tests from every one of my previous and current doctors over the last 3-5 years - it cost me a bit, but was well worth it.

At my appointment on September 26th, I brought a copy of an echocardiogram done by a physician who believed that my mytral valve prolapse was a wrong diagnosis and thus there was no need to take antibiotics before dental appointments. Well, that test proved that the mytral valve was fine, every other valve wasn't and the aortic septum was aneurysmal. But the neurologist didn't think it was of any importance.  He said I might want to mention in to my family physician. He again told me to continue with my medications, hreviewed the symyptoms of stroke and told me to get myself to the ER when I next experience one.  When I asked what other options were available, he said that the literature showed that by-pass suregery was ineffective and that when I have another stroke they might consider stenting the occluded MCA - he had known of people who had not expereinced another stroke for as long a three years! Wow - what a comforting prognosis...

I went home to reearch more on the internet and made a trip to the University of Washington Health Sciences Libray so that I could read for free and make copies of the complete articles I was finding only abstracts of on the internet. Armed with this information on October 1st, I made an appointment to see Dr. David Newell at Swedish Neurosciences Institutue in Seattle on October 16th. He has performed over 250 STA-MCA by-pass surgeries and written and number of journal articles regarding Moyamoya and the various surgeries. I then contacted Dr. Steinberg's office on October 5th.

Dr. Steinberg made the diagnosis of Moyamoya, and on October 16th Dr. David Newell confirmed the diagnosis. He told me that if I had atherosclerosis, there would be evidence of it throughout my body, not in the cerebral ateries alone. (Forgot to mention that I took the old echocardiogram report to my cardiologist, who immediately performed a TEE to make sure there were no holes in my aortic septum and to look for athersclerosis - no holes and no plaque).

Soooo, I fly to Stanford on the 25th, for tests and then an STA-MCA by-pass on one side October 31st and on the other side November 7th. It's been a long, slow process geting to this day. But, I truly believe that I've found an angel in Dr. Gary Steinberg and his excellent staff and that all will be well.

Kim Tiller

P.S. I fired the Harborview neurologist and will be following up with the Dr. Likowsky at the Swedish Neuroscience Institute in Seattle.
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Mar
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #1 - Oct 21st, 2007 at 7:01pm
 
Hi Kim, SmileyWelcome to our MM family!

I have to praise your aggressive stance you’ve taken in your case. You go girl!!! I wish everyone was like that, and then we wouldn’t see so many unnecessary strokes when new patients deal with the lack of MM knowledge out there. You were so wise to get a second opinion, it saves lives, and your research lead you to the best MM expert and staff in the world. Many have said the program there at Stanford is the strongest MM program currently in place anywhere!

I just wanted you to know you’ll be in my thoughts and prayers. Have a safe trip to Stanford and know your MM family here will be there with you in spirit the whole time.

Please keep us posted.

God bless,
Mar
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KTiller
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #2 - Oct 21st, 2007 at 8:17pm
 
Thank you for the prayers, Mar - I really appreciate it. If not for the great advice given by all who have written to this site, I might not have been as diligent in following through with my search for the right diagnosis and treatment. I am so very thankful to all who has shared their stories and information about Moyamoya disease.

Now I'm just trying to keep it all together until the surgery. I had a blood transfusion last Wednesday - that was a strange experience. I've had a pretty common problem with uterine fibroids and heavy menses for the last couple of years - hoping menopause will solve it soon - but not yet. My hematocrit and iron levels got too low. Will have these checked again on Tuesday. I have a great family doctor who is keeping in touch with Dr. Steinberg's staff, so should hear back before I leave on Thursday. Kind of feel like I'm on a roller coaster ride.

Kim
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Rena
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Hi, My son Tyler was diagnosed
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #3 - Oct 21st, 2007 at 9:54pm
 
Wow Kim!

I know how it feels to have to fire a neurosurgeon, something tells me firing a neurologist feels just as good, since you would only fire them when you know where better treatment can be found.

I am glad you were aggressive in your research, it will pay off well. I know it did for us.

I will keep you in my prayers.

Rena
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I've learned to never underestimate the impossible. -Blake Sheldon-&&There are no failures, just options tried. -Thomas Edison-&&
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moyamoi
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #4 - Oct 21st, 2007 at 11:10pm
 
Hi Kim,
Congratulations in being so proactive in your determination to get answers!! It is so refreshing to see someone who actually researches and follows the advice available.
I know everything will go smoothly with the STA-MCA bypasses.
Best wishes Moira
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STrantas
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #5 - Oct 22nd, 2007 at 9:08am
 
Kudos on sticking to your guns, Kim!

Good luck with your surgeries!

-Shari
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STrantas http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/strantas?ref=p STrantas  
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gotchlorine
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Our daughter, Tara, lives
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San Jose, USA, usa, 24, 158, CA, California
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #6 - Oct 22nd, 2007 at 4:17pm
 
Hi Kim,

It's good to see you posting here and, as you can see, there are some wonderful folks who frequent this site.  You'll have alot of support through thought and prayer from people you've never even met!

I'm very much looking forward to meeting you.  Have a safe trip south, and I'll come find you in between tests towards the end of the week.

Smiley Jill (in Dr. Steinberg's office)
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KTiller
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #7 - Oct 23rd, 2007 at 1:48am
 
Hi Jill,
I 'm so looking forward to meeting you. I'm overwhelmed with the kindness and support I've received - thank you all. I especially needed it today.
The neurologist called me this evening after receiving an email from his assistant informing him of my decision to have surgery. Despite knowing of the diagnosis by both Dr. David Newell at Swedish and Dr. Gary Steinberg at Stanford, he still insists my blocked cerebral arteries are due to "refractory hypertension". He says that I don't fit the profile for Moyamoya due to my age, 54. I read that Moyamoya typically occurs in the first decade and between the third and fourth decades of life - but I'm only four years outside that range and I have read of others with the disease who are older than I am (boy, do I feel old today). I've also read that hypertension is pretty common among those with MMD - keeps the blood flowing through the collateral vessels. He didn't hesitate to tell me that there was no guarantee that the surgery would be effective and that it was a very risky procedure. When I asked why he hadn't told me of the surgical option, he told me that he didn't believe in offering false hope...
But, I do have hope. If God is willing, I'll be leaving for Stanford this Thursday. I'll have the STA-MCA By-Pass surgery and I'll get this MMD thing fixed.
Has anyone else had this kind of resistence from thier (ex)nerurologist?
Kim

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Mar
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #8 - Oct 23rd, 2007 at 2:13am
 
KTiller wrote on Oct 23rd, 2007 at 1:48am:
Has anyone else had this kind of resistence from thier (ex)nerurologist?

Sadly, I've heard MM patients being told they are NOT candidates for surgery more often than I've heard they are. The key is research, and getting a doctor who is experienced with this rare disease, and then the facts speak for themselves. Delay in treatment is the particular pitfall we see because of the lack of experience and understanding in the medical community. We see and hear all too often, many doctors tell their patients not to have surgery because it’s too risky, but what many new patients do not know is, even though you may like your doctor and they may even be a very good neurologist/neurosurgeon, BUT, many times it’s just that they are not educated enough about MM “the disease itself” which actually makes the "risk" more about their lack of knowledge of MM, rather than actual risk to the patient. That’s what I’ve found over the years here.

Mar
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tiomasai
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Arriba Arriba!

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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #9 - Oct 23rd, 2007 at 8:39am
 
Hi Kim,

Yes, I too encountered resistance from a neurosurgeon, one who has even done surgeries on moya moya patients, though less often than some of the moya moya specialists out there.  This neurosurgeon has a very conservative view on treating moya moya.  I got multiple 2nd opinions after I saw him (when he told me I didn't need surgery), and everyone out-voted him. 

Upon getting that news, he called me to tell me I was making the wrong decision.  I had him talk to my brother (who is an MD, though not a neuro and was my advocate at the time).  He told my brother that there is no cure for moya moya and that no studies prove that this treatment will make things better for me.  While he's not necessarily wrong, my brother told him that there's no proof that surgery as treatment WON'T help either.  So why not?  It should be the patient's choice, and we felt the treatment is the next best thing to a cure.  While I am still at risk for strokes, like most moya moya patients, I feel a heck of a lot better knowing that I did everything in my power to improve my health and reduce those risks, even if it was a little bit. 

And in my opinion, age has nothing to do with moya moya.  I know many say it's usually the first decade or third decade of your life, but I've seen people of all ages with this disease. 

Don't worry about your ex neurologist.  Know that you've made the right decision for you and stay strong and move forward.  I am a patient of Dr. Steinberg's and you'll be in great hands out there.  Tell my buddies out there that I said hello!

My thoughts are with you -- keep us updated.

Hugs,
Trina
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KTiller
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #10 - Oct 24th, 2007 at 8:25pm
 
Thanks, Trina - it nice to know I'm not the only one. Seems to me it's critical for a doctor to provide all of the options along with the risks and odds of success and failure to their patient (he has or should have more knowledge than me) - then let the patient make the choice. My primary care, ob/gyn, and cardiologist all do this. They're are all about the same age as me, whereas the neurologist was much younger - maybe he simply needs more experience. But, he won't be practicing on me,

Tomorrow morning, I leave for Stanford. Kind of scared, but sure that I've made the right choice for me.
Kim
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Lore
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My brother Kevin (Cubbie)
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Delaware, USA, usa, 419, 133, OH, Ohio
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Re: Going to Stanford...
Reply #11 - Oct 24th, 2007 at 9:12pm
 
Hi Kim and welcome!

Good job! Kudos to you for being your own advocate and taking care of business!

My brother Kevin (Cubbie) had gone misdiagnosed for 4 years after suffering two strokes, a dissected right upper internal carotid artery, was way off balance, skin looked gray and he had trouble speaking.  He was told he had everything and anything but MM.  He had a doc that said he had never seen anything like it meaning the collateral vessels and sent him home to (in his words) "live out whatever life he had left." Can you imagine?!

The rest is history. We found this site and  Kevin had two STA-MCA bypasses in May of 2005 at Stanford with Dr. Steinberg and Kevin is doing very well.  It's absolutely amazing.  I have said this before and I will say it again, if it hadn't been for Dr. Steinberg and the entire MM Stanford staff, it goes without saying Kevin would not be with us today. They are truly remarkable and we are forever indebted to them for giving Kevin a second chance at life.

You will get excellent care at Stanford and Jill will meet and greet you and spend time with you and your family.  She sat with me through Kevin's surgeries and I'm still in awe of her support and care of those coming to Stanford.  It's nothing like I have ever witnessed until May of 2005. Jill is a sweetheart.

Please know that many on this site have been treated at Stanford and that you are in our thoughts and prayers.

Keep us posted!

Hugs,

Lore 
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"What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
 
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