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America's Best Hospital (US News) (Read 24968 times)
Shan
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MM Survivor ~ May 27,
2005

Posts: 849
Honolulu, USA, usa, 376, 346, HI, Hawaii
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America's Best Hospital (US News)
Jul 20th, 2005 at 12:56am
 
I'm not sure if any of you have seen the latest list of "America's Best Hospital" that was published in U.S. News.

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/health/best-hospitals/tophosp.htm

The Honor Roll 
Of the 176 medical centers that appear in this year's edition of America's Best Hospitals, 16 earned Honor Roll status, a mark of particular distinction. To be on the Honor Roll, a hospital had to demonstrate breadth of excellence by achieving a high ranking in no fewer than six specialties. The Honor Roll order is based on a point system that awards 2 points per specialty for ranking close to the top and 1 point for ranking slightly below that. (details below)

#1.  Johns Hopkins Hospital, Baltimore
32 points in 16 specialties

#2.   Mayo Clinic, Rochester, Minn.
28 points in 14 specialties (#1 for Neuro)

#3.  Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston
24 points in 13 specialties

#4.  Cleveland Clinic
23 points in 12 specialties

#5.  UCLA Medical Center, Los Angeles
22 points in 14 specialties

#6.  Barnes-Jewish Hospital/Washington University, St. Louis
18 points in 11 specialties

#7.  New York-Presbyterian Univ. Hosp. of Columbia and Cornell
17 points in 10 specialties

#8.  Duke University Medical Center, Durham, N.C.
17 points in 9 specialties

#9.  University of Washington Medical Center, Seattle
15 points in 10 specialties

#10.  University of California, San Francisco Medical Center
15 points in 8 specialties

#11.  University of Michigan Medical Center, Ann Arbor
14 points in 10 specialties

#12.  Brigham and Women's Hospital, Boston
10 points in 7 specialties

#13.  University of Pittsburgh Medical Center
9 points in 7 specialties

#14.  University of Chicago Hospitals
8 points in 7 specialties

#15.  Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia
8 points in 6 specialtie

#16.  Stanford Hospital and Clinics, Stanford, Calif.
7 points in 6 specialties

Scoring: Within each specialty, hospitals that ranked at least 3 standard deviations (S.D., a statistical measure) above the mean received 2 points; those ranked from 2 S.D. up to but not including 3 S.D. above the mean received 1 point.
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"Love, Accept And Respect All Things And All Situations In Life … They Are Especially&&Designed For Your Personal Learning" ~Howard Willis
 
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Mar
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #1 - Jul 20th, 2005 at 2:14am
 
Although it's always good to know the top hospitals in the country, I gotta say, for the sake of the new MM members seeking experienced doctors or medical staff for moyamoya disease, that the rating does NOT help a moyamoya patient at all, if they do not specialize in the study and research of moyamoya or have the experience in treating the disease.

For example--The University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia made 15th, (above Stanford) yet, they would have killed my niece there, in all honesty. They did NOT know enough about moyamoya the disease or have a tenth of the experience as Stanford.

Experience in treating MM is what is important when searching for a good hospital and neuro dept., not a rating such as that, IMO.

Mar
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« Last Edit: Jul 20th, 2005 at 2:42am by N/A »  
 
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Shan
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #2 - Jul 20th, 2005 at 1:37pm
 
HI Mar,

I agree with you... I just thought I'd post it as "food for thought."  As a matter of fact, I did not see the hospital where I had my MM surgery; and at first I thought "wow"...however, even though I was not at one of the hospitals on the U.S. News' America's Best Hospital List, I do believe I did go to America's Best MM doctor...of course, this is my opinion....just because Dr. Fukushima has done the most successful MM cases in the U.S.  His MM cases probably outnumber others in the U.S. because he currently practices in Japan well MM is prevelant, as well as around the world. 

I know this site is a big fan of Dr. Steinberg, (and I'm probably going out on a limb by saying all of this) and truthfully, if I was given the option to see Dr. Steinberg, I probably would've decided on him too..epsecially because I only had 2 days to get to North Carolina from Hawaii for my emergency double bypass...as well as for the mere fact that California is much closer than Hawaii.  It would've also made a difference in the travel cost, flight time, etc.  However, maybe my case was a little more difficult...and my neuro felt more confident with the outcome of his patients that have been seen by Dr. Fukushima. 

I'm sure Dr. Steinberg is a well qualified MM surgeon as I read everyone's posts, and it seems like he has a great office staff as well! 

I noticed you mentioned that "the University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia made 15th, (above Stanford) yet, they would have killed my niece" which may be true, but they may not "specialize" in neurology/neurosurgery, specifically MM disease.  In all honesty, not all surgery/treatments are successful.  I do know of a patient whose outcome was fatal, and she was a patient of Dr. Steinberg...and I do know that many of his patients have to return to him for "corrective" surgery.  However, like I mentioned earlier, each of our cases are different.  We too have successes in our lives, as well as failures...but after being diagnosed with MM, I have to say that my life has changed....I value it a lot more than I did before...

Bottom line...Mar, I apologize if you thought my intentions were to "promote" MM patients to seek out one of the hospitals on the list.  I worked in the surgery department at our hospital and like to read about other institutions across the U.S......As a MM patient, I fully understand the importance of finding someone experienced in surgically operating on a patient with MM, and as DJ once said someone experienced in the treatment MM.

Take care,
SFH   Wink
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"Love, Accept And Respect All Things And All Situations In Life … They Are Especially&&Designed For Your Personal Learning" ~Howard Willis
 
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Mar
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #3 - Jul 20th, 2005 at 3:26pm
 
Shan wrote on Jul 20th, 2005 at 1:37pm:
Mar, I apologize if you thought my intentions were to "promote" MM patients to seek out one of the hospitals on the list.

I absolutely did NOT think that, and I have no idea where you came up with that. I simply was stating the facts as I know them, and again, the facts are, that the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia did NOT have the experience in treating MM, yet they were rated higher than a experienced MM research medical facility.

U of P said my niece should NOT have surgery when she was diagnosed with moyamoya. She had 4 devastating, debilitating, life-changing strokes and had to be medically air lifted to Stanford with Dr Steinberg, who saved her life. So, my point was ONLY, that 15th on any scale or rating, doesn’t help a MM patient if they don’t have experience with MMD. I was simply stating the facts for those who come here to seek information about a medical facility with MM experts, and NEVER at any time did I think you were promoting anything other than posting recent statistics, and yet you come back out of no where and dis Dr Steinberg on the boards, with all kinds of innuendo, when he has the credentials as one of the best MM specialists in the country?? Yes, you did go out on a limb girlfriend!! Not right at all!!! I’d like to know, what was your purpose in that?? It wasn’t helping others seeking an expert in MM, that’s for sure!!!

This website is NOT a fan af anyone!!! It goes by credentials, facts and the purpose of helping others with this rare disease!

Mar
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Lore
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Delaware, USA, usa, 419, 133, OH, Ohio
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #4 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 9:11am
 
Shan,

"I disagree wholhartedly with what you have to say, but defend to the death your right to say it" - Voltaire

After reading your response to Mar's response, I felt obligated to clarify some points and "set the record straight" on behalf of Dr. Steinberg and all his patients.

First and foremost, the hospital listing has nothing at all to do with MM if it doesn't specialize in MM or have a MM program.  To this end,  the listing is, for the most part, meaningless as it relates to MM. I could shoot a 1,000 holes in that hospital list at it relates to MM.  Let me substantiate my statement by giving a couple of personal experiences after contacting over 25 institutions including many on the list to try and get my brother treated for MM. The Cleveland Clinic is ranked #4.  They are clueless about MM and admit it.  Why?  Because their specialty is Heart and Guts NOT MM.  Also, UCSF Childrens Hospital is not listed and they have a special MM program!!  I think you get the point.

When no other doctor or facility would give Kevin the time of day, along came these two wonderful and very humble people named Dr. Gary Steinberg and Teresa Bell-Stevens the "King and Queen of moyamoya".  They have done far more for Kevin than any other doctor or facility in the US and we are eternally grateful to both of them and Stanford for giving Kevin a second chance at life.  And by the way, Kevin is doing remarkably well.

Where did you get the notion that Dr. Steinberg's patients have to return for corrective surgery????  That statement implies Dr. Steinberg does a "half baked" surgery.  TO THE CONTRARY!!!!!!!  If you read the NY Times article you would know that Dr. Steinberg has performed well over 200 successful MM surgeries.  Sure there have been deaths associated with MM just as there is with any other severe and/or chronic condition or illness but that does not mean it was the result of Dr. Steinberg's surgery.  Statistically, Dr. Steinberg's surgical success record is unprecidented and unheard of for any surgery and especially this type of surgery.  Because he is an expert in MM and has perfected the procedure over time and that is also mentioned in the NY Times article he has an extremely high success rate.  Keep in mind, medicine is not an exact science and therfore not a perfect science -  for obvious reasons.....we are all different.  No two MM cases are exactly the same.  They have common threads but are not exactly the same.  There are also "other factors" that need to be taken into account.  There are genetics, physical and mental health and other illnesses or symptoms one may have in addition to moyamoya that perhaps makes them more valunerable and at a much higher risk for any surgery not just bypass surgery. I actually got confused about where you stand, because in one breath you are implying Dr. Steinberg"s surgeries are "half baked" that patients need to return for corrective surgery and that as a result his surgeries are fatal and in the next breath you are saying you would go to him for surgery yet you didn't.  What's up with that?  It's simply nothing less than BS because you are talking out both sides of your mouth.  Why don't you tell us how you really feel but this time GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!!!!

There is no other MM program in the US like the MM program at Stanford.  There is no other MM specialized doctor in the US like Dr. Steinberg.  He is also "world renowned" in moyamoya.  In fact, he had just returned from Japan when Kevin had surgery at Stanford in May of this year.

I respect your right to your opinion but because you did not have your facts straight about Dr. Steinberg's surgical expertise and implied that he was less than an expert surgically, you owe Dr. Steinberg and all his patients an apology.  Don't ever come to this site and imply what you implied about Dr. Steinberg or any other doctor without first having your facts straight.  Enough said!!

Lore
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Mar
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #5 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 10:07am
 
Well said Lore!!! You go girl, and my sentiments exactly!

I think it’s a sad that anyone would slyly make derogatory statements, designed to smear an admired MM expert’s reputation, whose credentials are impeccable. I don’t understand what it proved. Some of the remarks came out of nowhere, and had nothing to do with the post, and I personally was offended!!

No matter what her purpose, or what she tried to imply, I’m proud to say, the facts and reputation of Dr Steinberg, speak for themselves. As you just mentioned Lore, the hundreds of MM patients whose lives he has saved, says it all. That is NOT my opinion, but FACTS and cited references for anyone to see.  

Mar
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« Last Edit: Jul 21st, 2005 at 10:08am by N/A »  
 
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DJ
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Been there, done that...

Posts: 721
Wichita, KS
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #6 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 11:44am
 
Shan,

I can make that list even shorter for those new folks and families who have to find us every day...

#1.  Boston Children's Hospital
Pediatric treatment of Moyamoya disease

#2.  Stanford University
Adult/pediatric treatment of Moyamoya disease

List complete!

The information and support on this message board (and this site, in general) are founded on two VERY IMPORTANT principles:

  • Medical 'fact' (based on documented medical research)
  • Support (based on our own, personal dealings with moyamoya disease)


I'm sure you can appreciate the fact that the goal of this site is to provide patients/families who have to find our site the factual medical information and personal support they need to get through a literal 'life or death situation'.  Factual medical information to be able to choose which medical facility and type of surgery best suits their individual case, then support once that decision has been made.

Statements such as "...I do know that many of his patients have to return to him for "corrective" surgery", OR "because (he) has done the most successful MM cases in the U.S.  His MM cases probably outnumber others in the U.S. because he currently practices in Japan (where) MM is prevelant, as well as around the world" without medical documentation don't go unchecked too often!

I would like to reiterate a point I've made previously that this site does not receive any sort of compensation or guidance from ANY medical facility.  We talk more about Dr. Steinberg and Dr. Scott simply because, based on all of the medical research, they are the #1 and #2 SPECIALISTS on Moyamoya disease in the country, PERIOD.

Like it's been said here many, many times... ANY neurosurgeon can perform the actual STA-MCA, EDAS, Pial Synangiosis, EMS, or omental transposition surgery commonly used to treat Moyamoya disease, but only a select few deal with Moyamoya on a daily basis and can help a patient/family decide which surgery and plan of action/post follow-up care is best for their situation.

As far as Dr. Fukushima goes, I have no doubt the man is a brilliant neurosurgeon.  In fact, I believe he is one of the most talented and recognized skull based, skull based tumor, Pituritary, Acoustic Neuroma, C-P angle tumor, Craniopharyngiomas, Pineal, Jugular Foramen Tumor, and Direct Cavernous Sinus surgeons I've ever heard of!  PLUS, he's had more neurosurgical procedures and instruments named after him than tequila has drinks!

The one thing that bothers me about that is... NONE of them are specifically related to Moyamoya disease!  Honestly, last night at work, I typed his name into Google and spent about 3 hours going through every link I could find looking for something... anything... with his name and 'Moyamoya' in the same sentence.  NOTHING.

Two questions I would have for you after my many years of dealing with Moyamoya are... #1 what exactly was the "double bypass" surgery you had performed on the right side (because I've never heard of that), and #2 if you are having the same symptoms on the other side, why that wasn't seen and addressed at the time of your first surgery?

Once again... it's the differnce between dealing with a brilliant neurosurgeon and dealing with a neurosurgeon who deals with Moyamoya disease on a daily basis...

Just my  Smiley

-DJ
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« Last Edit: Jul 21st, 2005 at 6:25pm by DJ »  

Adversity does not build character... it reveals it...  I help my neighbor and my neighbor helps someone else. Life is a wonderful circle!
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Nancy_N.
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My daughter Mandy Has
Moyamoya

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Jasper, USA, usa, 436, 230, GA, Georgia
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #7 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 8:01pm
 
Shan,
       I most definately have to agree with then all Dr. Steinberg and Scott are the #1 & #2 for MOYAMOYA TREATMENT AND SURGERY. You have affended many, that man has saved my daughters life Dr.Steinberg!
Oh and imagine maybe with no intruments named after him. This site is to help out and to educate people about MM nothing else, certainly not a list of whos the best hospital...exactly how is that helping someone with this disease. I didn't comment on your other posts cause I was too mad but not youv'e gotten carried away with yourself. I have been on this site from one of the very first posts and do not remember reading alot of people having to have surgery redone. Go on jibber jabber if you just want to post cause your bored....we like facts here!
                          Nancy
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Shan
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MM Survivor ~ May 27,
2005

Posts: 849
Honolulu, USA, usa, 376, 346, HI, Hawaii
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #8 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 9:45pm
 
Wow...didn't mean to offend anybody...  I've realized through my experience, especially as I am recovering that life is too short...but I'm glad you were all able to voice your opinion about my post.  I guess I too was misunderstood about some of my comments.  About the "corrective" surgeries, I met a couple of patients of his here in the Islands, and they told me of their experience.  Other than that, I've heard (through this website) only good things about him...and like I said in my previous email, I probably would've went to him as well if I was given that option.  I have no doubt of his skill with MM...you are all a testimony!

I see that many are very defensive, and I can understand why...I too am very grateful for my doctor who basically "saved" my life!  Really, this is bringing me to tears as I write this...as no harm was intended. 

Lore, I see you said I owe Dr. S and all his patients an apology?  I do apologize if I offended anybody..which obviously I did..but even in my original email, I stated that I'm sure he was a well qualified surgeon..and from the posts, he has a great staff as well.  I guess to be fair, if I posted something negative about my neurosurgeon, would that have made anyone feel better?  When we ask about traveling to the West Coast istead of all the way to the East...a physcian here explains to us why he no longer sends his patients to Dr. S, but I'm sure there are those who may also not agree with Dr. F as well....thus we live in the land of the free...America...with the right to choose.  I know that every case is different and also made mention of that as well.

Mar, I can truly relate to your story as I too was told by our #1 hospital here that I did not need surgery, and in fact, I was told by 2 neurologists that "nothing can be done."  Therefore, I know how grateful you must be for Dr. S and his staff!  They were a blessing in your and your nieces life....and I'm a true believer that things happen for a reason...

Nancy, I read that you're upset and therefore didn't want to comment on my other posts....I understand...I'll try and hopefully find answers I'm looking for regarding MM....hope you too accept my apologies.

DJ, My sincere apologies....if I should've posted this in the "Jibber Jabber" as Nancy wrote below...We all have enough to worry about in life (especially with MM), and it wasn't my intentions to "stir" anything up.  I know I'm new here and many have built long lasting friendships here....  In fact, I've told many here in Hawaii about your site because I found it to be the most informative and supportive on MM on the entire web!  (I'm hoping that they don't run into this subject...)  Please keep up the GREAT work you've started!  This site has been a tremendous help to me and my family and friends!

Anyway, we all have enough challenges in our lives (especially with dealing with MM)...so please don't be so angry.  If I could take back my original posting of the hospital list, I would.  I'm literally in tears and need to stop before my pressure raises....I have to say, this is the first I've felt so bad and in tears since my surgery....

From the bottom of my heart...I wish you all the best....I see I've outstayed my welcome....I'll try not to post anything, but If you don't mind, I'd like to visit just to get more information about MM....Take care & God Bless!

Aloha,
SFH
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Shan
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MM Survivor ~ May 27,
2005

Posts: 849
Honolulu, USA, usa, 376, 346, HI, Hawaii
Gender: female
Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #9 - Jul 21st, 2005 at 11:03pm
 
DJ, Mar, Nancy, Lore,

I just wanted to send you an individual message apologizing for "stirring" things up with my posting about America's Best Hospitals.... I guess we may have misunderstood each other's intentions.  I truly did not mean to upset or offend you or anybody else, which I did. 

Lore, I have to let you know that your opening comment: "I disagree wholhartedly with what you have to say, but defend to the death your right to say it" - Voltaire really hit home, maybe because I did come so close to death about a month and a half ago...and I would not ever choose death over something I said in my postings...Like I mentioned, after being diagnosed with MM, I truly value life more than ever.  I think you may have misinterpreted me...   Unfortunately, I do know of a surgery that didn't go well....but I'm sure ALL surgeons, doctors, etc. aren't 100% successful, even we aren't in our own personal endeavors.  I also said that if given the option to stay on the west coast instead of the east, I probably would've done so because of financial, travel reasons.  I think you were writing out of anger...and I was shocked by your accusing me of " talking out both sides of your mouth."  Those are such harsh words...sorry you feel that way...I really do...

I am facing challenges with my recovery right now and can't believe that the email responses literally brought me to tears.  In fact, a friend of mine who I referred to this site to find out more about the disease just called and asked "what's going on?"  (She found the topic...)  She said she believes it was a "misunderstanding from the start...like an snowball effect."

I truly had no bad intentions...as "God knows the intent of our hearts.."  I hope you all you can find it in your hearts to forgive me as well...

Take care,
SFH Smiley
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gotchlorine
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San Jose, USA, usa, 24, 158, CA, California
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #10 - Jul 22nd, 2005 at 1:58am
 
There are several things for all of us to remember . . . refreshers from "Netiquette":

#4:  "Remember, if your message can be misunderstood, it will be"

#7:  Speaks of facts vs. opinions, and the importance of citing references to facts.

Shan,

I didn't respond to your posts for two reasons:  one was time constraints today and the second was that I didn't want to hastily write in anger.  I will say that the "many of his patients have to return to him for corrective surgery" statement about Dr. Steinberg without a cited reference was very disturbing.

I am the mom of an 18 year old girl who had her surgeries with Dr. Steinberg in June 2004.  Tara's surgery experience was wonderful, and I am deeply indebted to Dr. Steinberg and his staff for keeping my daughter alive and hopefully giving her many more decades of life.  Since Tara's surgeries, I have attended 17 MM surgeries at Stanford.  Though each patient has come from a different "start point", all have had positive outcomes.  As part of my effort to support others through the surgery experience, I try to keep educated and up to date with the track records of the MM experts.  For this purpose, I would be very interested in knowing the source of your information.

I personally have no problem with the sharing of your good experience with Dr. Fukushima, and am glad that your surgery was successful.  As DJ did (but not to the same detailed extent), I too looked for mention of MM and Dr. Fukushima.  There was nothing, though his credentials are certainly impressive.  As DJ and the others have said, there are very few MM experts . . . neurosurgeons who deal with MM on a DAILY basis.  (Believe me, nothing would make me happier than to have an abundance of MM experts!)  The point I'm trying to make now is that newcomers to this site are looking for information and need to know how important it is to find a doctor of this particular calibre . . . specific to MM . . . and these doctors are few and far between.

Regarding your comment about "outstaying your welcome".  As far as I'm concerned, you haven't!  I think some mistakes were made in your posts, and we all need to take care with what we place on a site that can be read all over the world.  People don't come here because it's fun - they come because they're frightened, and in need of information and support.  We become like a family and, guess what?  Families argue and families have problems.  We try not to hurt each others' feelings, but it happens on occasion.  We learn from each other and support each other to the best of our ability.  It's not always easy, and things get misinterpreted, even when the intentions were good.  The sign of a successful relationship is when the people involved learn from their mistakes and move forward in a positive way.  We're all in this together, so let's not lose sight of why we're here and what we're here for . . . support!

Jill



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« Last Edit: Jul 22nd, 2005 at 2:41am by gotchlorine »  
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #11 - Jul 22nd, 2005 at 3:14am
 
SFH,

I would like to comment on your last posts'. As I look at it Shan, I don’t see a misunderstanding at all. I think your original post about the top hospitals, was fine. I think the discord stemmed from your response to my post about it. I was simply trying to direct any new MM sufferers' on the right path, yet your following remarks went off in another direction, without a reason, implying things about a dedicated, brilliant MM expert, with NO facts or cited references. That would raise an eyebrow from anyone, and believe me Shan; it wasn’t that Lore misinterpreted you. I too felt as though you were speaking out of both sides of your mouth. You can’t say in one paragraph that you agree with someone and then turn around and imply the complete opposite.

Even now, you’re still saying things I don’t understand. For example, you said to Lore…
“I guess to be fair, if I posted something negative about my neurosurgeon, would that have made anyone feel better?”
What was that?? C’mon, that’s not what this website is about! These are good people here, facing many challenges, the same as you, and their only purpose through their struggles, is to help and support other MM members/families. Where was the support in your remarks??

You also say,
“Please don’t be so angry.”
To set the record strait, I for one was not so much angry, as I was offended, and upset!! Not only because you tried to smear a great doctors reputation, but also because you could have harmed another MM’er seeking help, by your remarks.

As far as your statement, “I see I've outstayed my welcome.” Not so!!! All MM sufferers’ and their families/friends are welcome. That’s what this website is for. DJ built and maintains this website solely for the purpose of helping and supporting others with this disease. He has made it a “home” for all MM sufferers and their families. We like to think of ourselves as “family” and “Home is where hearts open and forgiveness and acceptance are the rule.”  -Kall

Mar
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Shan
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MM Survivor ~ May 27,
2005

Posts: 849
Honolulu, USA, usa, 376, 346, HI, Hawaii
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #12 - Jul 22nd, 2005 at 3:53am
 
Jill,

Thank you for your reply and for taking a moment to gather your thoughts before "hastily writing in anger," something I am afraid I am guilty of...

Well, my first instinct was to ask one of the people I referred to in my post to respond to all of our emails, so she could share her story about her corrective surgeries, etc.  with you too.  In fact, she is actually a member of this website, and that's how I got to know her...(I am sure she is reading all of this, but may now be hesitant to share her personal experiences.  However, I will send her a private e-mail and kindly ask her to send you her story.) 

Nonetheless, I'd really like to put this all to rest.  I found myself really stressed, hurt and in tears....probably because I do turn to all of you for support like I would my own "family".... However, I can't seem to apologize any more than I already have....and it would be best (especially for our health) for us to use our energy to focus on other more important things concerning this rare disease.   

As a "new" member, I wasn't able to find out information about this disease until after my emergency surgery, and I found this site amazing!...filled with information and stories from others in similar situations like myself. I also previously posted that this site plays a big part in my recovery....as I was able to find out if others are also feeling the same things I'm feeling, or having the same tests that I am, etc.  I guess that's why it saddened me to see how Nancy felt: "I didn't comment on your other posts cause I was too mad but not youv'e gotten carried away with yourself"  It has been from other members' responses to my posts that have really brought me comfort during this time of need and provided such valuable information to me and my family. 

Thanks again, Jill.  I truly respect and appreciate your email.  Best wishes to you, your daughter and family.

Sincerely,
SFH

p.s. I will defnitely send an email and ask her to send  you a private email regarding her personal experiences so that you may understand where I got my information.
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CarasMOM
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My 11 year old Cara has
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #13 - Jul 22nd, 2005 at 4:52am
 
dear SFH...
...believe me I understand your state of mind during this time and I experienced a little of what you did during Cara's surgeries too....she did not have Dr. Stienberg nor Dr. Scott...she had Dr. Meyer of the Mayo in Rochester.  I didn't realize some others had bad experience with him...but I am forever thankful that Dr. Meyer pretty much saved Cara's life.  We just followed our hearts and where it took us.  It wasn't until after Cara's surgeries I FINALLY had a clearer mind to really research everything.   Once the misunderstanding clears you'll feel better.  Hang in there.  I always seem to learn from such experience, makes me a better person....and move on.  ;Grin Tight hugs,  CarasMOM
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Warm Hugs and Prayers, CarasMOM (Carol)
 
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Lore
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #14 - Jul 22nd, 2005 at 9:18am
 
Shan,

I accept your apology. I don't believe that you ever intended to make non factual or evil comments about Dr. Steinberg.  Please know we are not attacking you we are attacking the situation.  It is imperative that anyone coming to this site to seek factual information be given factual information.  The problem lies in your choice of words. It is imperative that it be made PERFECTLY CLEAR that it is a FACT that Dr. Steinberg has NEVER and I repeat NEVER had to "re-do" or "correct" a bypass.  This is where the problem lies.  If you know someone who has had to return to Dr. Steinberg it is for something new and separate and different from the actual bypass itself. The new, separate and different problem may require surgical intervention but is an ADDITIONAL surgery  for a SEPARATE problem as a result of the progression of the disease of maoyamoya but not to "re-do" or "correct" the bypass.  Moyamoya is a progressive disease.  There is no cure.  It is not like removing  tonsils and the problem is cured.  Moyamoya disease is like a cancer and  the "Everyready Bunny" it keeps going and going and going. It is not a question of if something will occur it is a question of when with moyamoya disease. It is the nature of the beast that other things can and will occur with this disease. The bypass is a life saving surgical procedure done in an effort to "save" a life. Without it, one will surely die eventually from stroke or hemmorrage. Let me give you a specific example to clarify further the point I am trying to drive home.  Before Kevin got to Dr. Steinberg, his ears were purple, his skin was gray, his speech from a previous significant stroke was worsening and his balance was way off.  Kevin was told by all other doctors to go home and live out whatever time he had left.  There was nothing that could be done.  Because I value human life and was not going to sit back and watch my brother die, I went on a mission to find someone who would be willing to accept Kevin as a patient and try and help him.  Of course I found this site and through DJ found Dr. Streinberg. Kevin was labeled "unique" by Stanford and Dr. Steinberg for a number of reasons.  He had had a significant stroke 4 years prior, he was misdiagnosed for 4 years so was not receiving proper treatment and proper drug therapy, he was 47 years old, he had a totally occluded and dissected right upper internal carotid artery and a negative blood flow.  It was perfectly clear that Kevin was brewing for another major stroke which would certainly have taken his life given all the negative physical symptoms he presented.  Kevin was considered the "worst of the worst".  Dr. Steinberg went where no other doctor would even consider going with the condition Kevin was in at the time. Dr. Steinberg could have easily said what all former doctors had said which was to go home and live out the life you have.  But instead, Dr. Steinberg took the "bull by the horns" took on the challenge and probably laid his career on the line when he attempted double bypasses on Kevin.  There is not a day that goes by that we don't thank God for Dr. Steinberg, Teresa , the Neuro Residents and Stanford Medical Center for taking a chance with Kevin and giving him a second chance at life. There is no greater sacrafice than the scarifice made by Dr. Steinberg to attempt a double bypass on Kevin given his condition at that time. Dr. Steinberg successfully performed double bypasses on Kevin.  Has Kevin had challenges?  Sure, but it has nothing to do with the bypass; it has do do with having a progressive disease.  The bypasses took wonderfully, reversed his bloodflow from a negative to a positive, and changed his color from purple and gray to normal. Other doctors are in awe of Dr. Steinberg's ability to actually bring Kevin's condition of one of almost complete normalcy.  It is absolutely amazing!  Dr. Steinberg is the "true miracle worker".  He has an impecable reputation and an unprecidented surgical success record that is not only a rarity in any type of surgery but absolutely extraordinary for double cranoiotomies.

Please know we are here to support all moyamoya patients and their families and that includes you.  We want nothing less than to hear good things about your progress. However, we cannot accept anything but the facts. We owe it to ourselves and others coming to seek information to carefully choose our words so the true affects of moyamoya are clearly and factually understood. Otherwise, this site losses integrity and becomes a garbage dump that is of no use to those seeking live saving treatment of this horrible rare and progressive disease.

Sincerely,

Lore
           
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #15 - Jul 22nd, 2005 at 10:24am
 
Shan,

Please don't feel like you've "outstayed your welcome", that is definitely not the case!  Please don't feel like you can't post here anymore... you CAN!

We all share a very special common bond and that makes us family.  Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you look at it), sometimes we act and react exactly like a 'normal' family does.

Everyone has made good points in this thread, including yourself.  We all just have to remember that someone that comes to the internet searching for information on Moyamoya has probably just been told by their doctor they have a rare disease that will most likely kill them sometime in the near future.

When they see our stories, they realize there might be hope after all!  They become sponges... soaking up every word from every post (especially in this category), and hopefully realize there is some light at the end of the tunnel after all!

THAT is what this family is all about!!


Don't sweat the small stuff.  Like you said... "life is too short"!

Smiley

-DJ
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #16 - Jul 23rd, 2005 at 1:14pm
 
HI all:

I had originally held off on replying to this line of posts for a variety of reasons.  I think everyone has said plenty about this situation.  For those of you who are new and are coming for information, I do want to emphasize a few things.  I want to state from the beginning that I am a patient of Dr. Steinberg's and think he did a wonderful job on me. 

The STA-MCA surgery can be done by any neurosurgeon with such experience.  Many with moya moya, and I have learned there are many who don't even come to this web site, go to surgeons without moya moya experience and have successful surgeries.  HOWEVER, it's important to go to someone with experience in moya moya.  Why?  If you have complications, they will have case history as to how to deal with it.  Given their experience, and that this is a rare disease and everyone is different, they can give a general idea of how to proceed with or without surgery, and after surgery. 

Every surgeon has its misses, and that includes Dr. Steinberg.  We specifically asked Dr. Steinberg if he had any fatalities during this surgery and if so, under what circumstances.  He said he did have a few (the Times article even discusses this I believe) but they were under older procedures that he no longer uses.  Did he hesitate to talk about them?  Yes, because no doctor wants to talk about the negatives.  My brother is a doctor and I still remember the day he came home after the first time he saw one of his patient's lose his life.  He was devastated. 

But the reality is things happen and it's important to look at the pros and cons.  Did Dr. Steinberg's fatalities stop me from going to him?  No, because he clearly had the experience and a running record of successes.  He clearly told me the risks but outlined the positives as well.  I had the benefit of my brother who asked every possible question on whether or not I should I have this surgery.  And Dr. Steinberg answered every one.  Having taken in all that information, I was able to make a final decision.  My father works at the Cleveland Clinic, and is a huge proponent of his workplace.  However, even this time he felt I had to go to an expert.  We didn't even bother with the Clinic (thank goodness, cuz I've been to Clinic enough times to wonder about its #4 ranking).  Smiley

So, my point is not to emphasize Dr. Steinberg's negatives.  My point to anyone who is out there looking to figure out what to do after just being diagnosed with moya moya is to look at all the information, ask all the right questions, and then make a decision.  Make sure the pros outweigh the cons.  And always, always, get a second opinion.  Even if you go to Dr. Steinberg, if you can, always get a second opinion.  I went to Dr. Scott, Dr. Connolley, two neurologists, and Dr. Steinberg.  I had differing opinions, so you probably don't have to go as crazy as I did, but a backup I think is always beneficial, no matter who you go to.  Doctors are only human, and hence, not infallible. 

Just my 2 cents.  Thanks for the forum.

Hugs & kisses to all,
Trina
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #17 - Jul 23rd, 2005 at 6:21pm
 
Hi All,

Well...I have been away from this wonderful site for a while since I have recently returned back to work and starting catching up on the most recent posts.  I was surprise and somewhat hurt for Shannon as I read the reaction to her original post. 

I believe that her intentions were pure and she did not mean to offend or hurt anyone.  I, too, feel forever grateful to Dr. Fukushima and his staff for all that he did for me.  But I guess we all feel the same for the doctors that help us through this challenging and complicated disease.  My decision to go to Dr. Fukushima was definitely a journey and one that my neurologist was confident with.  My neurologist has sent many of his other patients to Dr. Fukushima in the past...with very good results.  As for specific moyamoya patients, I can't say for certain exactly how many there were.  But I do know that he does and has performed many direct and indirect bypasses here in the US as well as in Japan.  Infact, there was a TV special on Dr. Fukushima in Japan, performing many different kinds of complicated brain surgeries that also included moyamoya.

Anyway, before deciding on Dr. Fukushima, I sent my brain films for second opinions to three different top Neurosurgeons at Northwestern, UCLA, and USF.  They all came back w/the same decision that I needed the STA/MCA bypass.  My husband, who is a physician, along w/ my neurologist helped me make this decision.  My husband was very impressed w/Dr. Fukushima and speaks very highly of him.

To make a long story short, I am doing great and am still recovery nicely.  It has been 3 months since my surgery and is back at work ... slowly working my way up to full-time status.  I guess we all have to have confidence in the doctors that we chose because they have our lives in their hands.  MANY doctors do not have the experience with this awful disease and you should always do your research before any kind of surgery.  That is why this site is soooo important and valuable.  It's a great form for fact and information.  Like DJ and many other says, if we stick to the facts and use only our personal experiences, it will continue to provide the support that it was intended for. 

Shannon...I will always be there to support you.  Keep your head up and continue to post things here because you have a lot to share.   Smiley Smiley

To everyone else...Thank you for your support and guidance.  It has made the road much smoother. 

With Much Love and Aloha,
Colleen
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Shan
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2005

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Honolulu, USA, usa, 376, 346, HI, Hawaii
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #18 - Jul 23rd, 2005 at 11:37pm
 
Cara's Mom, Trina, Tiomasai, Colleen...

Thank you for your email and for letting us know how you personally felt about this topic.... I truly appreciate you taking the time to respond.  

---------------------------------------------------------------------

I understand the importance of ensuring that only facts (to the best of our knowlege) are posted here to give us all a better understanding of this rare disease and therefore have a question...  

DJ stated "I'm sure you can appreciate the fact that the goal of this site is to provide patients/families who have to find our site the factual medical information..." and one of the 2 "very important principals here is "Medical 'fact' (based on documented medical research)"...and Jill wrote to me {"many of his patients have to return to him for corrective surgery" statement about Dr. Steinberg without a cited reference was very disturbing.}  I understand and appreciate the reasoning for this and will promise to do my best in remembering to provide documentation of where I am getting my information from in the future.

That being said, in all fairness, I'd sincerely like to inquire if the statements below should also cite a reference?  In my statement above..one example, is that I, personally heard through one of his patients that she had to undergo 3 surgeries with Dr. S and 1 of them was considered a "corrective" surgery....but unless that particular patient decides to share her story, then I shouldn't have made such statements since I did not experience it first hand and therefore could not actually provide Jill/others an actual site/documentation where this could be found---in which I sincerely apologize.   :(

I am not doubting the statements below to be untrue, nor do I want to cause any more controversy....I'm more interested in finding out where this type of information can be found/cited.  It will be helpful to all of us, as well as new MM patients searching for answers.

The statements in question are:

- Lore:  "It is imperative that it be made PERFECTLY CLEAR that it is a FACT that Dr. Steinberg has NEVER and I repeat NEVER had to "re-do" or "correct" a bypass."

- Nancy N: "Dr. Steinberg and Scott are the #1 & #2 for MOYAMOYA TREATMENT AND SURGERY."

Can I find this on-line? literature?  (I didn't see the NY Times article, so I'm not sure if the above statements were cited there.)  Please let me know.

Thank you,
SFH
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« Last Edit: Jul 24th, 2005 at 1:25am by Shan »  

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CarasMOM
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My 11 year old Cara has
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Sedalia, Missouri
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #19 - Jul 24th, 2005 at 3:56am
 
SFH,

If you touch on "Links" above.
then touch on Moyamoya Links.
then scroll down to the bottom it will have the New York Times article.

Smiley CarasMOM
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Warm Hugs and Prayers, CarasMOM (Carol)
 
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Shan
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #20 - Jul 24th, 2005 at 4:50am
 
DJ,

Sorry it took me a while to answer your 2 questions...

"Two questions I would have for you after my many years of dealing with Moyamoya are... #1 what exactly was the "double bypass" surgery you had performed on the right side (because I've never heard of that), and #2 if you are having the same symptoms on the other side, why that wasn't seen and addressed at the time of your first surgery?"

#1 what exactly was the "double bypass" surgery you had performed on the right side (because I've never heard of that)
--The procedure performed as indicated on my operating report: "Right temporal craniotomy for external carotid artery to internal carotid artery bypass specifically superficial temporal artery to M3 bypass times two, also vascularized periosteal graft to the right temporal parietal pia mater."  In other words, one branch of the superficial temporal artery was anastomosed to one segment and the more posterior portion was connected to another....(The 2nd was done for back up...double protection to prevent multiple surgeries in the near future).  

I also tried looking it up on the internet and found a few cases regarding double bypass brain surgeries, although, they were not specifically related to MM diagnosis.  (I was not diagnosed w/MM until my third opinion).
- "A 56 Y.O Woman with long history of headaches and multiple left sided TIAs not responding to medical management. Angiogram showed right ICA stenosis with pseudoaneurysm. She underwent double ECA–ICA bypass, using both radial arteries." http://depts.washington.edu/neurosur/ptcare/sekhar_ptcare.html

- Richard Smith's case where they connected 2 separate arteries..."Dr. Neil Martin, UCLA Faculty Professor and Chief of the Division of Neurosurgery, was featured for performing a rare double brain bypass procedure on a patient, Richard... http://www2.healthcare.ucla.edu/international/newsletter/Past%20Issues/English/July2003English.htm

- Double by-pass brain surgery on a 15 yr old boy...
http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_fullstory.asp?id=21196

#2 if you are having the same symptoms on the other side, why that wasn't seen and addressed at the time of your first surgery?"
--My MRI/MRA, Arteriogram, etc. showed no signs of MM at the time of surgery on my other side, and (thank God) that recent MRI/MRA still confirms this to still be true today.  I know; however, that MM is a progressive disease and my neuro will be keeping a close watch.  The "tingling" feelings which made me worried about having MM on my other side turned out to be a side-effect from an anti-epileptic medication I was taking.

I hope I was able to answer your questions.  Please let me know if this helps..

Thank you,
SFH  Smiley


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« Last Edit: Jul 24th, 2005 at 5:13am by Shan »  

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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #21 - Jul 24th, 2005 at 4:56am
 
Cara's Mom,

Thank you! I followed your directions; however, after creating an account with the NY Times, in order for me to view the article, I would have to purchase it for $3.95 (probably because it is already archived..either that or my computer illiteracy is evident here).  However, I searched the www and found the article (at no charge) at
http://www.stanford.edu/dept/neurosurgery/YTxx%202005-03-29%20D%20001%20Bs-C-4C%20E1.0.pdf.

I appreciate your patience and help.....as I slowly learn my way around this wonderful site.

Aloha,
SFH  Kiss
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« Last Edit: Jul 24th, 2005 at 5:09am by Shan »  

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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #22 - Jul 24th, 2005 at 8:17am
 
Shan,

As an FYI to you, I have emailed you the New York Times article to you directly to your email.  Please note that there are FACTS in there as to Dr. Steinberg's success rate and some others that I think you will find interesting. 

I think it's time that we move on and away from this topic.  We don't want people coming to this website and reading all the negatives when there are so many positives to this site and what we are doing here....and that is providing support, commpanionship, information, and an "MM Family."  We don't want to put any of the specialists in a negative light because what they are doing and have done for so long is saving MANY lives and giving us a chance at a longer life.  I would not discount anyone who can do that.  I'm lucky to be here and I owe my life to Dr. S. as many others here do, as well as the other MM Specialists. 

This is just my Smiley

Smiley
Michelle
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Michelle
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DJ
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Re: America's Best Hospital (US News)
Reply #23 - Jul 24th, 2005 at 8:36am
 
It looked like the Stanford link to the New York Times article only had the first page of the article online.  Here is a link to the full text of the article hosted on this site:

http://www.moyamoya.com/NewYorkTimes.doc

Smiley
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