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Post surgery violent behavior?? (Read 5105 times)
lenasfriend
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Post surgery violent behavior??
Aug 26th, 2005 at 4:41pm
 
My friend had brain surgery about a month ago for an 80 percent blockage.  A month later, she is in the hospital having some time of attacks making her swear and scream at everyone around.  Doc's say it's not seizures, but some of the less violent episodes appear to be seizures.  These episodes have been going on for over 24 hours now, and docs don't have a clue.  Anyone else have any info. on what's going on with my friend??
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debs
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Re: Post surgery violent behavior??
Reply #1 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 7:18pm
 
Lenasfriend,
I don't know if this relates directly, but when I was in the hospital (for around 2 weeks after intensive care) after having a major stroke, I remember hearing many "reactions" to stroke (or brain attack), including swearing, screaming, persistent crying.  I remember reading about that as one of the symptoms of having a stroke.  I think I was the only one on the entire floor who did not have any outbursts.  I was just so glad that they were helping me learn how to talk, walk, & take care of myself.  I found out later that if I hadn't moved my thumb on my affected side, I would have ended up in a nursing home. 

Anyway, this could still be a result of her brain surgery.  Each part of the brain, esp. when operated on or survives a stroke, can cause different reactions, depending on where the surgery was.  You might want to look up Dr. Daniel Amen, a clinical neuroscientist, who writes many books on the brain & behavior.  Good luck!  Just my 2 cents worth....deb
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LisaH
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Re: Post surgery violent behavior??
Reply #2 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 2:20am
 
Hi Lenasfriend,

First,  I wanted to ask if Lena was back in the hospital directly because of the violent behavior or because of some other symptoms.

I agree wholeheartedly with what Deb said- anytime the brain is disturbed, be it by surgery, stroke, trauma etc. there very well could be some odd behavior/reactions.  The brain is very delicate and may react in some way to being fiddled with. 

I can relate though.  Smiley When I had my last surgery in April I had surgery on a Wednesday and came home Friday morning.  Why did I make record time?  Because I am a VERY bad patient when it comes to brain surgery. Smiley  While I didn't swear and scream at everyone in the hospital I was not a happy camper- okay maybe I swore at my sweetie (take me home NOW or I'm getting a taxi you @*$&%^) Undecided   I was definitely not myself for quite awhile after this surgery.  Very grumpy, depressed etc.  Still have my off days.  My poor family & friends- I publicly apologize right here and now! Kiss

I think if Lena's doctors don't find anything wrong via tests (such as seizures, brain bleed, swelling etc.) then maybe it's just a matter of waiting it out until her brain settles down and gets used to it's new "wiring". 

Thank you for being a concerned friend.  Hang in there!
Lisa
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"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I--I took the one less traveled by, and that has made all the difference." - Robert Frost
 
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CarasMOM
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Re: Post surgery violent behavior??
Reply #3 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 3:42am
 
Hi...

...don't know if this will help ...my dad (who didn't have MM)...had numerous of strokes over the years...different parts of the brain.  And there were periods when he'd be so angry, so mean to mom, not wanting to be around people...it was hard to watch.  The doctors felt the area he had stroke was the area the anger/meaness is from that was affected and to give him time....I forgot what medication they put him on but it lift his moods, calmed down and as time went on he felt better.  Everyone is different but the brain is a difficult organ, very sensitive and I feel it is also unpredicable, too....so many factors and so many outcomes.

Will keep your friend in our prayers.  Carol
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Warm Hugs and Prayers, CarasMOM (Carol)
 
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Lenascousin
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Re: Post surgery violent behavior??
Reply #4 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 1:29pm
 
LisaH,

Lena was at the DR's when she started having what we thought were seizures.  They lifeflighted her to Boston where they did a EEG and determined that she is in fact not having seizures, we are left clueless as to what is going on.  She's fine, then yawns a couple of times then goes into what is entire body convultions (that look like seizues) in which she swears like never before and screams for people to not touch her.  It is extremely painful and draining for her.  And as clueless family members it's heartbreaking to stand by and watch.  We don't understand what is going on and how long she will have to go through these.  Cry Thank you to everybody for any ideas, or if you've seen this before, any help.
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LisaH
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Re: Post surgery violent behavior??
Reply #5 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 2:26pm
 
Hi,

A few more questions- just trying to get the big picture:  Who is Lena's surgeon if you don't mind me asking? Do any of the doctors she is seeing have experience with Moyamoya?  Has she recently had a CT scan or MRI/MRA?  Which surgery did Lena have (direct/indirect)?

I'm not a doctor but if they ruled out seizure, it sounds like these episodes *might* be TIAs.  A lot of people on this board have had similar episodes (including the yawning)- many are also on seizure medications for even seizure-like symptoms .  Personally, when I've had very bad TIAs, I get a litte worked up because it's scary and frustrating (hence maybe the swearing?).   I also don't like to be touched, nor really spoken to.  I have to have quiet and calm.  It seems like when I'm in the midst of a very bad TIA anything and everyone is just too much stimulation.

I'm sure this is extremely scary and frustrating for both Lena and her friends and family.  I hope Lena's doctors can figure out what is going on very soon.  In the meantime, know that there is great support here for you all.

SmileyLisa
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"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I--I took the one less traveled by, and that has made all the difference." - Robert Frost
 
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CarasMOM
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Re: Post surgery violent behavior??
Reply #6 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 7:47pm
 
Cara has had over 300 TIA's ...all after both of her surgeries....and has had the EEG and 24 hour EEG they say she does not have seizures...they didn't say "TIA" either but its something like that.

Cara's spells are very quick...when she yawns its the end of it then she moves on (unlike Lena's convulsions).

Cara was having up to 12 TIA's a day...her neurologist immediately put her on Trileptol (very mild anti seizure medication and no need to check blood regularly for this one)...it helped ALOT...reducing her spells slowly to zero over time...once in a while she'd have one. 

These spells started couple weeks after her second surgery and continued on for months.   She has a follow up MRI and MRA this Friday...first since surgery....we are anxious to hear the results of that.

MoyaMoya is still a rare thing that it helps to have "experts on MM" look into ones case.   You could even send Lenas films for second/third opinions without even seeing the MM specialist, too.   

We were lost when Cara was having all these TIA's...but immediately after the Trileptol....the difference was seen.   they even told us it may not work because she isn't having seizures but it may help slow them down (sure did...what difference)...shes been on it for a year (dosage was increases as she got little bit bigger).

Will keep Lena and her family in our prayers,

Carol
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Warm Hugs and Prayers, CarasMOM (Carol)
 
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lenasfriend
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Re: Post surgery violent behavior??
Reply #7 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 9:03pm
 
Thanks to all who have replied.  I witnessed one of these episodes with my friend, and can explain a little more in detail what is happening.  She starts with three yawns then she starts swearing loudly, which is out of character for her, and her body becomes spastic.  Her legs come together and are rigid.  Her arms also come together and are rigid also.  She continues this loud swearing throughout these spastic episodes and appears to be in some type of pain.  She does not focus on anything at the time, and appears to be unaware of those around her.  Her arms, still together will move to the other side of bed, as do her legs, going back from one side to the other.  During this time, her body remains totally rigid and her head sways back and forth.  The one I witnessed lasted about four minutes.  Then she falls asleep, and wakes up a few minutes later with slow speech and very tired.  She was fighting staff trying to help her during her first day of these episodes, and very angry toward them.  Noone touches her or talks to her anymore during episodes, because this was making it worse.   After two more minutes, Lena is back.  Her talking is normal and she is back to her own personality.  She has been exhausted these last couple of days in between episodes.  To try to answer some of the questions, she was brought in to the hospital because of these episodes.   The episodes started at home and seemed to be triggered by light.  The only thing that happened at the beginning was that she saw strobe lights in her head when entering a brightly lit room.  Then they progressed to these more severe episodes I have described.  When the docs shine light in her eyes, it automatically triggers these episodes.  She was at her primary, and they were quite concerned, and lifeflighted her to Boston.  I do not know the name of doc, but he is at Brigham and Children's Hospital.  She is still hospitalized.  They are now saying they think her brain is tired and is becoming overstimulated resulting in these episodes.  She has had an EEG and I believe another MRI.  They say the sight of surgery is fine, and nothing is showing up.  These episodes were described to me as violent from those who saw the first day, but I didn't feel they were violent, possibly because noone touches her anymore, they let them ride out.  Her swearing is not directed towards anyone.  She is still in hospital and wanted me to describe in detail what's going on in order to get as much info. as possible.  She was also wondering if Lisa H and Caras mom could explain the episodes  you talked about her, to see if there are similarities.  Thanks to all for your support.
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