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Learning disabilities?? (Read 6979 times)
ashley
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Learning disabilities??
Sep 25th, 2009 at 9:52am
 
My 12 year old daughter was recently diagnosed with moyamoya.  She had been plagued with 'dizzy' spells, was often light-headed and would often complain about seeing flashes of light.  She experienced her first TIA about a month ago.  The neurologist at UNC performed a number of tests including an MRI and MRA which provided her diagnosis. I am not very happy with the approach that her neurologist is taking as he wants to just monitor her and take a 'wait-and-see' approach.  At her follow up appointment yesterday I inquired about when he thought we should consider surgery and his response was 'not until she has a stroke because the surgery is too risky'.  He also said that she may not progress any more than what she already has.  I am very concerned because all of this information goes against everything I have read regarding the disease. Needless to say, my husband and I are seeking a second opinion.

One major question that I have and have been unable to get an answer on is whether or not other children afflicted with this disorder have learning problems in school.  My daughter has always struggled in school, from kindergarten until now.  I have had her tested and we have done different types of therapy and tutoring in the past.  I was told when she was 6 years old that she was ADHD (although she was never 'hyper') and she has been on medication since then.  Now I am worried that perhaps the moyamoya has been the problem all along.  Her comprehension is very poor, she doesn't retain information well and she is very easily confused.  She has trouble keeping up with her homework assignments, multitasking and I have to help her with pretty much all of her work or she is unable to complete it.  I really feel that all of these issues have gotten worse, especially in the past year.  Has anyone else had children with similar issues??

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mg12061
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #1 - Sep 25th, 2009 at 10:11am
 
Welcome, and let me say I was soooo glad to read that you will seek another opinion.It really angers me to hear that your doc wants you to wait until she has a stroke. I would not waste any time getting that second opinion so she DOESN'T have to suffere a stroke.My daughter was 5 at the time of diagnosis and she suffered several strokes in a matter of months.This disease will progress and no one can tell you how quickly it will.I'm not sure I can help you with your question becasue my daughter was also born with Down syndrome so she had academic difficulties before her diagnosis.What I can tell you though is she doing amazingly well  even though she had a very devestating stroke which left her like an infant,and she has Down syndrome.I do think that her increased blood flow since surgery and the fact that she has had no strokes or TIA's has had a positive affect on her learning. She's doing amazinly well.She never fails to amaze her teachers in school.I believe that since moyamoya disease changes the blood flow to the brain that it can certainly affect learning,especially since she is showing symptoms of lack of blood flow. this is a great site and is full of information.I'm not sure where you live but it would best if you can consult with one of the specialists that are listed on this site.My daughter had ehr operations at Boston Children's hospital with Dr. Scott.It sounds like your right on top of things and you are right to be concerned aobut your Dr's reccomendation to wait.Please keep us posted and ask away if you have any questions.Your family is in my prayers.
Mary Grace
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« Last Edit: Sep 25th, 2009 at 10:13am by mg12061 »  
rgrace5  
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #2 - Sep 25th, 2009 at 11:18am
 
Hi Ashley, Welcome to our MM family!

You are so right to be concerned about the “wait and see” approach, it is definately dangerous and risky, so go with your gut instinct. The more you learn about this rare disease, the more easily the answers will come. The facts will speak for themselves. The fact your neuro wants to wait until after a stroke is barbaric, and automatically tells you he does NOT have enough MM experience with this disease. The surgery is meant to PREVENT that stroke/death, not wait for it. This is a successfully treatable disease in most cases, if you have a MM experienced doctor. The "risk" he spoke about is more about his LACK of his knowledge of MM, rather than actual risk to the patient, and what’s important to know is, surgical management is the ONLY treatment for MMD, so MM experience is everything for success!!

MM symptoms are different for everyone, depending on where the blockage is in the brain, and to what degree. It can even have no symptoms for some, but fatally strike. It certainly can affect her learning without a doubt. She is not getting the proper blood/oxygen, nutrients to the brain, and this is a progressive disease. It only gets worse over time. Having MM with some people is just likely to cause symptoms such as TIA’s (mini strokes) fatigue, fogginess, reactions to extreme heat, headaches, tingling, confusion (Especially when doing many things at a time - easily distracted) etc.. This is all due to the body having such a hard time getting the blood around your brain, due to all the roadwork of vessels. Things move much slower. Her MM vessels grew to try and help with the blood flow, but they are ABNORMAL vessels. They are weak and fragile and can rupture at any time. That is why all MM patients are at risk for a stroke or hemorrhage. Waiting is dangerous!

Please learn all you can about this disease, and you will learn that without surgery, the majority of individuals with Moyamoya disease will experience mental decline and multiple strokes because of the progressive narrowing of arteries. Without treatment, this disease can be fatal as the result of intracerebral hemorrhage.

I don’t know if you viewed this Stanford video under Links on the website, but if not, this may be helpful in your research in understanding MMD as well.

Stanford video – Moyamoya Disease
http://www.moyamoya.com/stanfordvideo/moyamoya2.wmv

It’s very wise to get a second opinion with a MM specialist. They deal with this disease on a daily basis and can put you on the best path for your case. A second opinion usually costs nothing but postage. Simply get copies of any films and send them, and they will review them and give you their expert opinion.

I’ll keep you and your daughter in my thoughts and prayers.

Mar
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gotchlorine
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #3 - Sep 25th, 2009 at 3:01pm
 
Greetings Ashley,

I'll add my welcome to the others, and Mary Grace and Mar have given you some excellent advice.  Waiting and watching is definitely not a good option!

My daughter was diagnosed with MM at age 17.  She had her surgeries 2 weeks after her diagnosis and, at age 22, is doing very well now.  Your question about learning disabilities hit home with me.  It wasn't until my daughter had an extensive neuropsychology test at age 20 that we learned she had very compromised reading comprehension (1% level).  She had had strong patterns of doing poorly on tests ever since 4th grade, but we and her teachers were never able to put our fingers on a cause.  She did very well in school - was attentive, worked hard, got along well with others, etc., and there were never any other red flags.  We assumed it was a testing anxiety or something minor.  She was able to compensate somehow, and came out of high school with a 3.5 GPA.  With the neuropsychology testing, it all finally made sense, though.

Present day, and she (Tara) is in her 5th year of college.  She still has significant struggles, but knows that she needs to read out loud to her self to retain information, and school gives her tape recorded tests with extra time for them.  Hopefully she'll get through college.

Of course, every patient is different, and your daughter may have other needs.  One of the difficult things I've found (in my daughter's case) is that people don't believe she has any disabilities.  They're floored when they learn she's had strokes.  If you were to look at her, talk with her, see what she can do physically now (mainly open water swimming events), you wouldn't believe it, either.  These kinds of disabilities often aren't easily apparent, so we're finding that she has to continually educate people regarding her limitations.  Not fun for a person her age!

Anyway, you've come to a good place to continue your education process.  There are some wonderful people here who will be happy to answer whatever questions you have (and trust me, you'll have a million of them!).  Don't hesitate to ask anything that comes to mind, and to lean on those who have walked in similar shoes for support.

Warmly,
Jill 
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Rox
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #4 - Sep 25th, 2009 at 3:50pm
 
Ashley,

Welcome!!  My daughter Emmily is now 15 years old.  She was diagnosed at the age of 3 and our neurologist at the time also had the recommendation to wait and treat the disease with medication.  She ended up progressing and having to have surgery at the age of 7.  I kick myself everyday for not being more aggressive at pursuing the surgery.  She ended up having a stroke one week after her first surgery.  If we had surgery earlier she would have been stronger and the progression would have not been so bad, I honestly believe she would not be living with the disabilities that she has now.  The stroke took half of her visual field.  She is blind from the middle to the left in both eyes and it will neer return.  She had her second surgery  3 years later and since then she has continued to improve.  Dr. Scott at Children's Boston was her Neurosurgeon and he is fabulous.  he will review your daughter's case and is an excellent communicator.  It has never taken him over 24 hours to respond to an email.  I would HIGHLY recommend a second opinion.

My daugher does have learning disabilities, but she is progressing normally in school with modifications.  We just had a follow up MRI last week everything is stable, so we are optimistic that the worst is behind us. 

Good Luck!!  Please feel free to contact me if you need any more information!!

Roxanne
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ntrlpwr
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #5 - Sep 27th, 2009 at 8:53pm
 
I too like Jill's daughter suffer from a learning disability but only after my surgeries was done bilaterally.  I couldn't remember a thing and able to keep things straight and read with a comprehension proper to my adult age.  I'm 35 and was tested extensively through neuropsychology tests and yes I tested very very low, but I'm in nursing school and doing quite well with the assistance of extra time and listening tools from the disability office but I have even found an incredible tool that would be helpful for any kid or adult that has a learning disability.  It's a system that you need to take a screening test and then they match you up..it's called the integrated listening system, you can check it out on the web..it's great it's helped my memory quite well and i'm able to concentrate much easier..i'm still going through the program and it makes my studying time a lot easier.
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aloha,&&Brandie
 
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soccermom
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #6 - Sep 28th, 2009 at 6:32am
 
I think there is some confusion about the classification of Moyamoya.  There is moyamoya disease, and moyamoya syndrome.  Those with the disease are faced with progression of the narrowing and abnormal collateral growth, while those with moyamoya syndrome may only have the abnormal vessels without progression.  Dr. Scott, who cares for my daughter, has also taken the "wait and see" approach and he is considered an "expert" in this disease.  I think that each case should be investigated  thoroughly and decisions made on a case by case basis.  As to the learning disability question.  My daughter has dyslexia and visual processing issues.  There is no way to know for sure, but speculation is that there is a relationship between these problems and low perfusion.
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Mar
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #7 - Sep 28th, 2009 at 12:28pm
 
soccermom wrote on Sep 28th, 2009 at 6:32am:
I think there is some confusion about the classification of Moyamoya.  There is moyamoya disease, and moyamoya syndrome. 

I don’t think there is confusion about MM. The facts speak for themselves. For example…

Dr. Scott himself states on his moyamoya “Questions and Answers” link…

Is moyamoya disease progressive, and will my child's condition worsen with time?


All patients with moyamoya disease will develop progressive narrowing of their brain blood vessels over time, and we have never seen an exception to this rule after more than three decades of studying these patients. Along with this progressive narrowing of the brain blood vessels, the patient's clinical condition also worsens; this is why we believe that surgery to increase the brain's borderline blood supply is so important for most patients. The rate of progression is extremely variable from patient to patient, however, with some patients experiencing a rapid course with many strokes over less than a year, and others a slow and desultory progression, which may take decades to evolve.


http://www.childrenshospital.org/clinicalservices/Site2156/mainpageS2156P9.html

That is why we always state that every case of MM is different because of the numerous individual factors involved, BUT that every case should be evaluated by a MM EXPERIENCED neurosurgeon because of the severe consequences without the proper treatment in his or her particular case. Unfortunately there is still a lack of MM experience out there in the medical community.

As I understand Moyamoya Syndrome, it’s the presence of other systemic diseases along with the intracranial Moyamoya findings, so yes that is a very important INDIVIDUAL factor, and why it’s so important to understand this disease and the importance of its management with a MM experienced neurosurgeon.

Mar
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mg12061
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #8 - Sep 28th, 2009 at 1:19pm
 
Mar, very well put.... I think it's always a good idea to consult with an expert on moyamoya.Even the experts will acknowledge the fact that no one knows how quickly it will progress.My daughter's progressed to a very severe stroke in a matter of a couple months. She's still recovering from this 7 yrs later.The other thing that is disturbing is to have a Dr. to not jsut say "wait and see" but wait until she has a stroke. If you wait for a stroke then ultimatly you would want to then wait until the patient stabalises which could take several weeks.My daughter's strokes were getting so severe and close together we didn't have the option to allow her to recover from her strokes before surgery.This made it so much more complicated and risky. Just my 2 cents.........
Mary Grace
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #9 - Oct 3rd, 2009 at 1:52am
 
Hello Ashley,

My 7 year old daughter has been suffering symptoms of moyamoya since she was 3. She was diagnosed in August of this year. She too has also been diagnosed with HDHD and a learning disability, both in the last 6 months. Her learning disability is undefined. We believe that the difficulty that she has in school is directly related to the moyamoya, as she developed at a normal pace earlier in life and her ability to perform well in school has also decreased over the past year.

She had her first surgery on thursday and will hopefully have her second next week. We hope to see an improvement in school over the next year or two. Good luck to you and your daughter!
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LA
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Re: Learning disabilities??
Reply #10 - Oct 3rd, 2009 at 5:57pm
 
My heart goes out to everyone who is struggling with learning problems, dyslexia, odd and sundry memory retention, coordination, inability to carry on a task or keep employment and wondering why,  and  all the other things that can go along with mm. Actually knowing I have mm has explained much of my frustration and answered many questions.  So, I relate to much of this.

At an early age (in the 1950's) they thought I might be retarded, or have a brain tumor. I had difficulties with 'left brain' sorts of things. Still do. No wonder, I had no vascular system there.
Now, tenish yrs post stokes and surgery, I'm amazed at the things I have to re-learn. It just goes on and on. Seemingly simple things that I expect (right!) to be able to do.
I'm actually doing quite well if I'm not faced with 'issues' but, since we're on  this very valid  topic I'm remembering, and realizing how much effort things take. Empathizing.

Moyamoya is so far reaching in it's significance to our lives.

I send love to everyone.

Linda (LA)
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Linda (LA)
 
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