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opinion- am I being a giant idiot? (Read 17835 times)
tuknits
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opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
May 10th, 2012 at 2:07pm
 
Okay - so I get Google news alerts for anything related to moyamoya every day. One came in my mailbox the other day titled "You want moyamoya." I went to the article and it turned out to be a review for a band named moyamoya that play in Jacksonville, Florida. The article didn't make any mention of how they got their name. I was curious so I looked them up. They have a page on Facebook. On their "About" page, their personal information says this:
“moyamoya: n. [moi uh moi uh]
1. A pattern of progressive obstructive and occlusive cerebral arteritis, predominantly in children and young adults.
2. In Japanese, A puff of smoke.
3. Band. Richard Dudley, Brennan Hamill, Scott Madgett”
On their news feed page, there are some pictures of their fliers. You can go to Facebook to check Multimedia File Viewing and Clickable Links are available for Registered Members only!!  You need to Login or Registerthem out (scroll down to see the fliers) if you want but basically, they are images we are all familiar with, they are CTA scans showing moyamoya vessels with information on where they are going to be performing.
So I sent the band this message:
Me:
I was just curious if you chose this as a band name because one of you has moyamoya or has a family member affected by it.
Their response:
Moyamoya:
No. Two of us work in a hospital and overheard "moyamoya" during a conference. We named the band moyamoya because of the Japanese translation "puff of smoke".
My response to that
Me:
I thank you for your honest response. I do not know you or the other band members and I am sure it was not your intention to offend any one when you named your band, but I have to tell you that I could not possibly be any more offended.
I come from a musical background and I am all for artistry and creative freedom, but using the name of this disease and then saying it is for the Japanese translation, quite frankly is a load of crap. I would buy that if you did not have
“moyamoya: n. [moi uh moi uh]
1. A pattern of progressive obstructive and occlusive cerebral arteritis, predominantly in children and young adults.
2. In Japanese, A puff of smoke.
3. Band. Richard Dudley, Brennan Hamill, Scott Madgett”

as your personal information on your Facebook page. The very first thing you have is the definition of the disease. Then, you use actual scans of occluded vessels from and individual's brain as your fliers. Do you have any idea how repulsive that is?  That's like calling your band lymphoma and using images of someone's tumors for your fliers.

I don't know what either of you do in a hospital setting to have overheard moyamoya.  I get it. It's a funny sounding word. Most doctors, for that matter most neurologists have never even heard of it. I assure you there is nothing funny about it. It is a very real, very serious, and potentially very deadly disease. Do you know what obstructive and occlusive arteritis is? Well let me tell you, I do. Children and adults die from this disease. Strokes, TIAs, aneurysms, seizures, speech loss, and the list goes on. It is progressive.  There is no cure. There is treatment, but no cure.

If you were someone who had moyamoya and were living with it - triumphing over it - great,  go for it - call your band moyamoya and use your brain scan as a flier, but this...I am sorry, from where I stand you have no right. You might as well call you band breast cancer and use pictures of someone's mastectomy scars for your fliers. It's equally offensive in my eyes.


As you can tell from my response, I was really furious.  I am really out of line? What do you think?
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« Last Edit: May 10th, 2012 at 2:13pm by tuknits »  

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hrsridermom
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #1 - May 10th, 2012 at 6:18pm
 
You go girl!!!!!
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tuknits
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #2 - May 10th, 2012 at 7:38pm
 
Thank you! I am glad it is not just me.

They wrote back and here is our exchange:

Moyamoya
We were not trying to offend anyone by naming our band moyamoya, sorry if you were offended. I don’t really feel like we need to justify why we named our band to you but I’d like to at least correct a few things. We don’t think the name is funny; we’re not belittling the disease or making fun of people with occlusive arteritis. We did not create the flyers of the brain scans. They were created by the venue we played. They were used and I personally do not find them offensive, but we preferred the “puff of smoke” definition so we try to shy away from images of the disease. We’re not showing patients going thru treatments or struggles associated with the disease. Moyamoya is not a funny word to me; it’s not a joke band. I feel like moyamoya must have affected your life in some way to be so upset by a band using the name. I’m sure there must be a lot of art that offends you and you have a right to be offended. If it offends you, don’t support it.

Me
I appreciate that you are not trying to offend anyone with the name of your band and in truth; I am not bothered by the use of the word. I did not imply that your band or its music was a joke, merely that when most people hear the word, they think it sounds funny and that may have led you to investigate the word and chose it for its meaning.
What I am bothered by is the use of the brain scan images in the fliers. I am glad to know that your band did not make them, but fail to see how you think that using them would not be offensive to anyone with the disease. You say that you aren't showing patients going through treatments or struggles associated with the disease, when in fact, that is exactly what that is. You are advertising your band using the images of a real human being that was either going through the diagnostic process or was being treated and profiting based off of someone else's disease isn't art. It's cruel.
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lynn
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #3 - May 10th, 2012 at 9:06pm
 
Good for you!  It is disappointing that they don't seem to comprehend the problem.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #4 - Mar 19th, 2013 at 11:02am
 
i'm one of the members of the band, moyamoya. actually, there was more to the conversation that was left out. here's the last portion of the conversation. our last response was -

"We're not profiting off someone else's disease, that's completely ridiculous. People aren't coming to our shows because of fliers that were made a year ago. This band has played a handful of shows and it's a creative project we all love. It's instrumental music, not exactly a money maker. I think the only issue here is the brain scan fliers. You don't see how people can view them as art? That's where we differ, I can. I'm not the only one, you can google "brain scan art" and find millions of images. I don't see how we're making light of it. We have different opinions, so be it. Sorry if you were offended, but we just have different feelings on the issue. I don't really feel the need to argue through facebook though, it's not going to resolve anything. We just have different opinions, have a nice day."

that being said, this really is just a matter of semantics... moyamoya is just a word. and for someone going through the disease, it means one thing. it's not the word, it's what the individual relates with that word. the word brings memories of hospitals, xrays, etc... for us, an atmospheric, abstract, instrumental band, we liked the idea of relating our music to smoke. something without defined edges, that moves sporadically, haze and space and void. this is the weight that we bring to the word and thus, what we relate to it. another example would be the word "f*g." In some cultures, current and past, the word means "cigarette." However, if it were used to degrade a homosexual, then it would be offensive. Words are just words. It's the intent of the person using them that matters. Again, we're very sorry that you are offended by the name of our group. You don't have to support it or like it or anything of the sort. but you do need to respect that we each have a different perspective. and we respect yours. we didn't go out of our way to start a conflict, did we?
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #5 - Mar 19th, 2013 at 11:06pm
 
Those who find brain scans "art" are obviously not aware of what it is like living with such a rare disease that can affect your everyday life.

Seeing as you heard the word Moyamoya in a hospital (1st clue) during a conference (Obvious 2nd clue), it is apparent that it is a medical term that is affecting many lives, which should have alerted you to the fact that there are other names for bands than this.  You should have done your homework on exactly how this disease is affecting people and what it has caused and then maybe you would have thought of a more proper name for your band.

Just like you used it because one of the definitions being "puff of smoke," our neurologists wasn't so selective ignoring serious issues regarding the name and they used every part of the definition including "puff of smoke" while explaining to us that my daughter had just had 4 strokes.  It wasn't cute, funny nor did any of her scans look like art to me and they NEVER will.  Instead, they still make me cry wishing I could take her place.

 


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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #6 - Mar 20th, 2013 at 11:51am
 
Hey band guy, why don't you read up on some of the stories on here, might give you more of an understanding of why it is upsetting to those people who suffer from, or love someone suffering from this disease. I guess if you really want to be known as that band, it's entirely up to you. Just read the stories on this forum before you get so judgemental of people's true feelings. I get thinking it's a cool word, but as a group trying to bring awareness to a rare and dibilatating disease, and the fact you heard it in a hospital, maybe you could see how it's hurtful to those who suffer. Just how I feel. It's a SUCKY disease!!!!
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #7 - Mar 20th, 2013 at 1:30pm
 
I assure you, we are very sorry for your troubles. And again, we are not trying to offend. Your argument does not however, invalidate my assertion that it is not the word, but the feelings of sadness for your daughter, that is causing you to have an issue with the name. You bring a certain semantic memory to a word, perhaps because the first time you heard it was in reference to the terrible thing that was happening to your daughter. Let's frame the situation differently. My father died of a heart attack after playing a few folk songs with some of his friends. He was a musician as well. This was 10 years ago but i still feel a certain sting, a slight clenching in my stomach, when I hear certain songs. I was watching a movie recently and one of the songs was played, "Morning Dew." My first reaction was discomfort but i didn't feel the need to write the parties involved in making the movie and inform them that they had really upset me. How were they to know it would upset me? How were we to know that you were out there to take offense? Do you think that we named the band that to hurt you? Or others? I can understand grief. I, as most, have had my share.  But it does no good to blame. That would be stage 2 in the grieving process. Bad things happen, to my father, you daughter, and everyone else. You won't find any peace in demonizing or vilifying us, or a word. Again, we're sorry for your troubles....
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #8 - Mar 21st, 2013 at 4:30am
 
I am not offended....but after reading the part that they first heard it in a hospital could be a little upset.  It does sound cool, so I can see the draw to the name. Thanks for being honest and sharing your opinions.

As an MM patient myself, I have the right to feel one way because of the association the word moyamoya has to me and how it has affected my life. you're point is clear and valid. I can't blame you for liking the name, but let's all just maintain a healthy respect for each other.



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tuknits
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #9 - Mar 21st, 2013 at 8:00pm
 
Ok, Mr. Band member. First of all, I would like to take you to task on your post in this forum. You chose to come here and post the "left out portion of the conversation". I assure you that I did not post the last exchange of our conversation on purpose to withhold information, but simply because it was clear from our previous exchanges that I was getting nowhere with you and chose not to continue discussing that conversation here as it was pointless. As you said, "it's not going to resolve anything. We just have different opinions."  So I left it alone. So now, almost ONE YEAR after the original conversation took place, you come here to a forum that is dedicated to moyamoya patients and their families to bring it all up again. You said you did not go out of your way to start a conflict, but yet here you are after all this time, bringing it all up again. So many of your arguments do not make sense nor do they hold up. You say that you "liked the idea of relating our music to smoke , something without defined edges, that moves sporadically, haze and space and void." Great. That may be true, but then don't list the definition of this disease on your Facebook page and don't use images of our brain scans to advertise your gigs. You said the fliers weren't created by you and that you like to focus on the "puff of smoke" definition. Then you went on to say that you are not offended by "brain scan art". Well, we could go on to debate whether brain scan images are art, but you weren't using them as art, you were using them to advertise your band. You fail to see the correlation between what you did and calling a band lymphoma and advertising it with scans of people's tumors or better yet what if someone had a band called heart attack and advertised it with images of a heart patient's angiogram. I am truly sorry for the loss of your father, but correlating hearing a song in a movie that made you sad because of your personal attachments to it, to us being upset at the use of a "word" that by DEFINITION means our disease (not a memory of an experience or feelings about a bad time in our life, but the actually disease) is not at all the same thing. You are comparing apples to oranges. You also claim "how were you to know that you were out there to take offense." I'm sorry, but that's complete crap. You work in a hospital and heard the word there. Then you looked up the word to know it's meaning. You have the meaning posted on your Facebook page. You used images of the disease on a flyer. To say you didn't know we "were out there" is bull. I am not saying you purposely set out to hurt people, but some off your actions have been truly offensive (intended or not), including coming to this website to post about a long since finished discussion. Please leave the people of this site alone.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #10 - Mar 23rd, 2013 at 10:35pm
 
You are not an idiot. I too also saw their Facebook page and was offended by it. For them to correlate it to the "Puff of Smoke" part because it was cool is so wrong. It was on my 50th birthday that I was discussing for the first time having brain surgery because I had this "puff of smoke" which all doctors use to describe the disease after using the official name of MoyaMoya. I hope the band knows that this dx came from the founding Doctors in Japan after doing many autopsies after their death. My life has changed forever, I will never be able to go back to a job I loved, can't drive, and have to rely on everyone else to help me. Now I'm looking toward more surgery as many of us know can happen.  Us patients and this website are here to help those of us who have to live and die with this. We are trying to make others aware of this illness, not aware of a band. By naming a band after us, you are defeating our purpose of educating other folks of what we live with each day.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #11 - Mar 25th, 2013 at 6:27pm
 
Look, we really meant no disrespect. Sorry we hit a nerve. It is just a word. We liked it for our reasons. You don't like it for yours. After this, I'll leave you to discuss our name without further intrusion. Perhaps, you can call us the "band that must not be named" or "you know who."
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #12 - Mar 26th, 2013 at 12:04pm
 
I don't think you're being a dick.  My son was diagnosed with Moya Moya after having an occipital lobe stroke- he is 38 years old.  He had bypass surgery on the 8th of March, so successful, that he had a temporal lobe hemorrhage the next day- the surgery restored the blood flow so well, his brain couldn't absorb it, small piece of skull removed, blood drained.  He recovered from both surgeries so well, his doctors were astounded.  Came home for 2 days, found him on the bathroom floor last Friday, EMT's called, stabilized in local hospital and air lifted to U of Minnesota. In a coma ever since with limited response to stimuli.  More hemorrhages, feeding tube, ventilator, no response to stimuli.  Took him off the breathing tube and feeding tube.  The doctors are keeping him on meds- pain and sedation until he finally passes.  It's been 5 days now, his heart just won't quit beating.  There is no chance of any recovery, due to the damage done to his brain from the strokes, hemorrhages, and surgeries to try to save his life. We keep hoping his heart will stop beating, we know he wouldn't want to live this way. 
A band that would use Moya Moya for their name cannot possibly understand the frustration and pain that is associated with this disease.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #13 - Mar 26th, 2013 at 11:37pm
 
I truly believe you never meant to disrespect anyone by naming your band Moyamoya.  However, now that you have learned the entire definition, read how it is effecting people's lives as well as the hurt and suffering we are all going through, you are now disrespecting all of us by continuing to come on a site meant to be used as a support group to defend your band and belittle us at the same time with your comments at the fact that this is just a word that we associate this with.  I suppose if your band were to ever make it big and receive a Grammy, that you would see that as more than a word wouldn't you?  Although, if a miracle does happen and you make it that big, please at least include the entire meaning of your name and help us raise awareness in your thank you speech!!!!  As for now, please stop responding and trying to defend your band so we can move on and be there for each other as this is what the website was meant for.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #14 - Mar 27th, 2013 at 12:54pm
 
How is your daughter?  I saw your post and wanted to let you know both of you are in my thoughts and prayers.  My son is still in a coma, he had limited response to stimuli after the 2nd hemorrhage he suffered on the 16th of March. But, after more episodes and surgeries, he quit responding.  We made the decision to take him off the vent and feeding tubes last Friday, the doctors didn't expect him to live beyond that, but, he's breathing on his own-that's about the extent of it. That strong heart of his refuses to quit beating. I know he's not there anymore, the things that made him such a vital and unique person are gone.  But now people feel the need to tell me about all these people they've heard of that came out of comas and from brain death, making us feel that we've made a bad decision and adding to the pain and anguish. I know, if he came out of this with only 10% of his faculties, he'd find the quickest way to kill himself. Is anyone else out there dealing with this?  I'd like to hear from them and how they deal with these well meaning but uninformed people.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #15 - Mar 27th, 2013 at 10:03pm
 
My daughter is doing ok.  She is still occasionally having TIA's, but we are just monitoring her and trying to live as normal as possible, although as you know it will never be truly normal again.

I am so very sorry to hear about your son.  I cried when I read your post and I have tears now as I type.  It's so hard to listen to others talk about their experience after you have already made the toughest decision you will ever have to make in life.  Every situation is different and although they mean no harm, it does no good telling you of situations where somebody they know has come out of this.  You know your son best and you did what you felt was the right thing and I truly believe he is holding on for you to show you how strong he is and how much of a fighter he is.  My heart goes out to you and if you ever need to chat or vent, please message me.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #16 - Mar 28th, 2013 at 12:03pm
 
Read the post by Jamie, it's about Scott, and I responded to her today. I talked to my ex (Scott's dad) today, he told me he's avoiding phone calls because people are telling him we should put the feeding tube back in, someone even told him we have to have a funeral service because, otherwise, God won't let Scott into heaven! Really?? It's not bad enough dealing with the physical, now we have to worry about Scott's immortal soul.  God--I just want to punch people for the inconsiderate, ridiculous things that come out of their mouths. Anyway, Scott's being moved into another facility, the U of M isn't long term care and they didn't expect him to hold on this long.  Another indignity inflicted on him. Thank you for letting me vent, nice to know there's someone else out there who understands.  I really appreciate you.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #17 - Apr 2nd, 2013 at 12:52pm
 
Scott lost his battle on Easter Sunday at 3:17 pm. I will miss him terribly, mixed feelings, I wanted him to come home.  But, I'm relieved it didn't drag out any longer, it's not what he wanted.  He had talked to me before all this happened, about the possibility of him dying, he'd wanted his brain to be donated for research, if there was any way things could be learned about Moya Moya and help prevent this happening to someone else.  Unfortunately, it wasn't to be and he was cremated.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #18 - Nov 7th, 2013 at 3:25pm
 
It's been a long time since I've visited this forum.  I was thinking of Scott today and thought I'd check it out and see if there was any new posters or info that would help me sort out the events of the last several months.  I still have so many questions about what happened to Scott, too many questions and no answers.  What ifs-- did we make the right decisions...it goes on and on.  Difficult to believe he's been gone almost 7 months, seems like just yesterday that it all started. Maybe I'm just feeling melancholy because the holidays are getting close, I suppose this is a bad time of year for a lot of people.  Or maybe it's just nice to vent to people you don't know, because the people you do know get tired of hearing about your grief and listening to you cry.  Since Scott died, I have a lot more empathy for people and will listen to their stories and give them a shoulder to cry on.  Anyway, it's taken a long time for me to get over losing my son, no-that's not right, I'll never get over that, but, I can talk about him now and tell funny stories about him without getting weepy.  Baby steps!  So, to all you fellow Moyamoya families, hang in there, it will get better.  Cry, scream, grieve at your own pace, there will come a day when you can think about your loved one and smile for a change.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #19 - Nov 9th, 2013 at 4:59am
 
Hi, Karen:  I understand what you are going through, I really do.  My husband had a stroke almost exactly four weeks after his EDAS.  He presented for the first time at age 58, though I think he was having TIAs for a long time that he either didn't recognize or didn't tell me about.  We went through the same thing you did only for a shorter period of time -- stroke, then seizures, then botched care at the local hospital, until not even the wonderful people at Weill-Cornell could save him.  He was unresponsive for two weeks and since his advance directive specifically said no trach and no PEG, I had to set him free.  He died 20 minutes after the ventilator was removed.

Today I am doing a garage sale with the proceeds going to research for both stroke and moyamoya.  A lot of his things -- things that he'd long forgotten about or never wore -- are  being sold.  Neighborhood kids are helping out and it is a final celebration of his life.  I too dread the holidays.  I'd be happy to converse via PM if you feel the need.
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Re: opinion- am I being a giant idiot?
Reply #20 - Nov 14th, 2013 at 10:55am
 
I really don't see the problem with it. To them it's just a name, to us it's a disease.
Look, you have the right to be offended but you can choose to ignore this particular band in stead of letting it get to you so much.
Besides, the only ones who know about this disease are either the ones suffering from it or their loved ones. No other  person in the word is going to see this band name and be like: Hey they were named after this uncommon disease.( which is not even the case begin with)
Sorry, but I can't see what is wrong with it.
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